From Forbes.Com
Sorry Liberals, America Was (Also) Founded As A Religious Nation
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It’s the Fourth of July!

Happy Birthday, America!

Yay freedom!

Also, especially given the latest goings-on, it’s time to remind you, America, between your liberalism and your bad religion, that you were founded as a religious and a Christian nation.

There’s a lot of confusion about this, on both sides, so it’s important to get things right.

On the progressive side, the following things are true: (a) yes, many of the Founding Fathers were not Christian, or not strongly religious; many of them were Deists or Unitarians; there is even some controversy over whether George Washington had a religion; (b) yes, the Founding Fathers built an explicitly secular government and structure for the state, based also on Enlightenment values. It’s important for conservatives to remember that America was never intended to be a theocracy or even a sorta-theocracy.

With that being said…

The problem is that from these few facts progressives get a great very many things wrong.

You see, if there’s anything the Founding Fathers understood–and that too many progressives seem to have a harder time getting a grasp on–it’s the difference between the state and the society. And another difference they too rarely seem to grasp is the difference between a government explicitly affiliated with a religious tradition and a government animated by values drawn from this religious tradition.

The argument was never that America had or ought to have a religious government, it’s that it was founded as a religious nation. The nation includes the government (at its various levels), but also the society. And this is indisputably true.


Because there is one inescapable fact: at the time of the American founding, the reason why so many Englishmen had come to settle in the United States was for religious reasons. They were Puritans and other sorts of radical Christians whose religion had been oppressed in Britain and who came to the United States to practice their religion in peace.

It is this crucial fact that gave the wonderful balance that gave rise to America: because so many Americans were fervently Christian, the Nation would have a Christian culture and society; but because they had seen their religious freedom oppressed, and because they were so many denominations, the government would be neutral with regard to institutional forms of Christianity and with regard to specific denominations. It was seen as self-evident than in a country where most people were Christians, their democratic representatives would govern according to Christian values.

Hence the Establishment Clause, which says absolutely nothing about Christian values in government, but says everything about the English experience and the experience of some states in the United States: the belief by the new Americans that having an established religion is wrong, not so much to protect the government but rather to protect religion.

Even the non-Christians among the Founders knew this. The Founders were nothing if not steeped in the Enlightenment and its rationalism, but they also understood the importance of Christian values in animating society and government. A great example of this is the famous “Jefferson Bible“, which Jefferson built by literally cutting out the miraculous elements of the Bible, but keeping the ethical teaching. In other words, even as Jefferson rejected the core of Christianity as it had been understood for 17 centuries–the divinity of Jesus, and his atoning death and bodily resurrection–he recognized that the ethics of Christianity were still vital to a sound moral order and a sound life. (And yes, one can’t help but wonder if he had accepted everything about Christianity, how his behavior in re: slavery would have been different.)

And of course, it is no coincidence that the Founders proclaimed in the Declaration of Independence that the reason why people had human rights was because they were so endowed by their Creator. (Even as they said nothing about the precise identity of this Creator, to protect religious pluralism.)

In short, it is totally correct to say that America was founded, yes, with a “secular” government, but as a religious Nation.

This is something that the greatest analyst of America, Alexis de Tocqueville, plainly recognized. He thought religion was absolutely vital to the American experiment. Here’s how he saw it: if you have a society where there is great freedom and great equality of rights, people will never stop competing with each other and comparing each other to each other; the successful will want to lord it over the less-successful, and the less-successful will resent the more successful, and political battles will become extremely polarized (sound familiar?); only with a robust Christianity can America avoid such an outcome, because then people’s attentions will be drawn away from each other and towards God. It is a crucial part of the mix, as crucial as the Bill of Rights and pluralism.

You may loathe the idea of a “religious Nation” and that’s fine. To say that a country’s culture and society is religious is not to say it has to be sectarian or theocratic. But I would just say this: the system we were bequeathed was designed to work with this element as a crucial part of the mix. Is it any wonder that our system of government has become wonky in the past decades? It’s the elephant in the room.

Regardless of your views about what we should do today, it’s nonetheless the case that this is how America was originally designed and envisioned.

Happy Fourth of July!

…and God bless America.

A mere OPINION that you had to copy and paste because you cannot think and write for yourself.

So because that is the OPINION of JUST ONE person, and because YOU posted it, it is obvious you are telling Jewish people, Islamic people, Hindus, Buddhists, Shinto, Baha'i, Taoists, etc etc etc probably should leave this country.   Or, they can stay, they can practice their religions in private, but their lives are going to be governed by Christianity.  

Sorry, buster, you're wrong


Oh, but wait, where does it say within Christianity, within the Roman Catholic religion, that people of low incomes must pay taxes for millionaires----that which you cheer for, post messages of praise, you praise the mayor and council for making the financially struggling and poor people pay the taxes of multimillionaires in downtown.

You ARE a joke, you ARE a HYPOCRITE


Go blow off some firecrackers.  I can't wait for tonight, we and some neighbors will have a very nice backyard show.

Why I’m Thankful for America’s Immigrants and Religion this Fourth of July
Two reasons I love America: her immigrants and religiosity.
Eric H. Yoffie  July 3, 2014

The Fourth of July is nearly upon us. As always, we Americans will barbeque in our backyards, watch fireworks, and celebrate America. And there is much to celebrate.

Americans are informal and down-to-earth. We introduce ourselves by our first names to practically everyone. We say “hi” on elevators to people that we have never laid eyes on. We don’t like folks who put on airs. We are unfailingly helpful and friendly. And if you think everyone is like that, spend a few weeks in Europe.

We talk a lot about freedom in America, and we mostly mean it. Rich, poor, or in between, we are assertive about our rights and stubborn about our liberty.

We are also a patriotic bunch, and reasonably united, despite our diversity. In a world where tribal loyalties are reasserting themselves, we have no ties of blood to bind us together. But we have the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, and the essential idealism and optimism of the American people.

There are two things about which I feel special pride.

The first is the way that America continually remakes herself. Great countries require periodic injections of new thinking and energy, and America is now rearranging herself before our very eyes, like a scrambled kaleidoscope.

The arrival of new immigrants is primarily responsible. Most come out of desperation, but they learn our ways with startling speed, and then, like others before them, they reshape America.

Last year a pipe burst in my home on a weekend and the shut-off valve did not work. With water pouring onto the kitchen floor, I called the two plumbers that I have used for 30 years; both informed me that they no longer provide emergency service. I grabbed the phone book and started calling plumbers; on the third try, I reached someone who said they would be there in 10 minutes. Two Hispanic men with heavy accents arrived, stopped the flow of water, did the repair, cleaned up the area, and charged a reasonable fee for their service. These immigrants saved my home.

And then there is the family of Asian immigrants that runs a fruit and vegetable store in my neighborhood. The produce is better quality than in the supermarket, the prices are lower, and the store is open every day, from early morning to late at night. And of course there are the immigrant nannies that care for so many children in my area.

It distresses me when I hear the strident sounds of ugly nativism from our politicians, directed against both legal and illegal immigrants, children and adults. Yes, the issues are complicated, but much of what they are saying is simply old-fashioned mean-spiritedness. And in trying to reserve America only for those already here, they will only strangle her spirit. Most Americans, I am convinced, want a more inclusive America. They know that there is room here for immigrants; and they know too that the invitation extended on the Statue of Liberty to all those “who yearn to breathe free” is an expression of who we really are.

The second thing of which I am especially proud is America’s exuberant religiosity. The talk of religious decline is mostly nonsense. American religion is constantly reinventing itself, but our country remains a place of deep spiritual energy. Four out of five Americans identify with a religious denomination; and of the 20% who don’t, more than half believe in God. In the industrialized West, no other country comes close to this level of religious engagement.

Religion thrives for many reasons. The Founding Fathers knew that separating church from state would promote religious commitment. And Americans are wise enough not to banish religion entirely from the public sphere; America pays for military chaplains, gives tax exemptions to places of worship, and allows occasional ceremonial prayer. Most important, Americans understand that religion provides an anchor of stability in uncertain times, and that when a people lose faith in God, it often means they have lost faith in their country and in themselves.

Sure, there is plenty to worry about. Our infrastructure is falling apart, and inequality is much greater than it was. And in dealing with all of this, our politics seem both petty and paralyzed.

But it would be a mistake to romanticize earlier eras. Those was no time in America’s past when harmony reigned. And the reason is that our raucous democracy invites contentiousness. Our task, then, is to accept controversy and do what Americans have always done: Battle for our values, and fight to fill the moral void in our land. But, at the same time, reach out to our fellow citizens, strive for mutual respect, and try to articulate political concerns that will draw us together as Americans at least some of the time.

Happy July 4th.

Rabbi Eric H. Yoffie, a writer and lecturer, was President of the Union for Reform Judaism from 1996 to 2012. His writings are collected at ericyoffie.com.

Copy and paste something that someone else wrote because you can't think or write for yourself





Go waste a 4th on the computer looking some someone else to copy and paste.    Our dinner is done, it's back in the pool the our fireworks

George Washington
" Religion and morality are the essential pillars of civil society."

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, –That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

~ Declaration of Independence

Quoted from DemocraticVoiceOfReason

George Washington
" Religion and morality are the essential pillars of civil society."

But he didn't say "Christian" Religion!  

So Washington included Jewish religion, Muslim Religion, Buddhists Religion, Wiccan Religion... etc!

Quoted from Box A Rox

But he didn't say "Christian" Religion!  

So Washington included Jewish religion, Muslim Religion, Buddhists Religion, Wiccan Religion... etc!

religion as a tool for politics to pray in public regardless of which religion....it's an area of the human psyche that
control must be used, just to validate their elected positions.

Quoted from Box A Rox

But he didn't say "Christian" Religion!  

So Washington included Jewish religion, Muslim Religion, Buddhists Religion, Wiccan Religion... etc!

America was founded by Christians as a Christian nation which allows people of ALL religions the Freedom of Religion.  
The leftist wing-nut Pelosipalosers would have people believe that Constitution provides for freedom FROM religion and that somehow people who are religious shouldn't be allowed to speak publicly on issues.  The reality is that we fought a Revolution (and other wars) to preserve the Freedom OF Religion and the Freedom of Speech for ALL people in this country -- and Our Founding Parents as well as many generations of leaders after that firmly -- and rightly -- believed that religion and morality are key pillars to a democratic society.

Be patriotic -- vote the anti-Religious Liberty Pelosipalosers OUT of office in 2014 and 2016.

Quoted from DemocraticVoiceOfReason

America was founded by Christians as a Christian nation which allows people of ALL religions the Freedom of Religion.  
The leftist wing-nut Pelosipalosers would have people believe that Constitution provides for freedom FROM religion and that somehow people who are religious shouldn't be allowed to speak publicly on issues.

The constitution provides for "freedom of speech" in the first amendment... regardless of ones
religious beliefs.
The constitution provides for "freedom of religion" in the first amendment... regardless of ones
freedom of speech.

Anyone is allowed (with few exceptions) to say what ever they please about religion or any other
issue.
Anyone is allowed (with few exceptions) to practice their religion no matter what that religion.

DVOR's bogus claim "that somehow people who are religious shouldn't be allowed to speak publicly
on issues" of course is just more Bull $hit... but we already knew that.

Quoted from DemocraticVoiceOfReason

The leftist wing-nut Pelosipalosers would have people believe that Constitution provides for freedom FROM religion and that somehow people who are religious shouldn't be allowed to speak publicly on issues.

You sound just like Jesus.

Oh wait a minute, no you don't.

Jesus teaches to love all people, not be a hater of liberals.

You shouldn't even be allowed near a church.

You hate liberals.

And you hate whiney taxpayers who don't like being robbed to support corporate greed.

Plus you take a holiday celebration of freedom and use it as a platform to preach your hate speech.

When you went to seminary school did you major in intolerance and hatefullness?

Quoted from Box A Rox

No the liberals were busy being buggered back in the woods.

Religion and politics go together like peanut butter and mustard.