Treaty or not. What if the treaty is rejected and scrapped? Then what?
We continue the sanctions that are now on the brink of being ignored by most of the world if the treaty fails. So then what.
The USA will continue the sanctions, the rest of the world will open trade with Iran... and then what if Iran continues to work on a Nuke?
What options are available if the sanctions are lifted or ignored and there is no agreement for Iran to stop Nuke production?
The only option left is the John McCain plan... "Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran"
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
Treaty or not. What if the treaty is rejected and scrapped? Then what?
We continue the sanctions that are now on the brink of being ignored by most of the world if the treaty fails. So then what.
The USA will continue the sanctions, the rest of the world will open trade with Iran... and then what if Iran continues to work on a Nuke?
What options are available if the sanctions are lifted or ignored and there is no agreement for Iran to stop Nuke production?
The only option left is the John McCain plan... "Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran"
What are you talking about? The only way the GOP can stop it is override a promised Obama veto, which is next to impossible in this case...McCain says as much
"Arguing with liberals is like playing chess with a pigeon; no matter how good I am at chess, the pigeon is just going to knock out the pieces, crap on the board, and strut around like it is victorious." - Author Unknown
Um... isn't this treaty going to the Senate to be ratified??? Isn't it in the US Constitution that the SENATE has to ratify any treaty???
So what is the problem?
UM ... didn't you read what I wrote ..Obama and Kerry do NOT consider this a treaty .. Quote from John Kerry "We’re not negotiating a ‘legally binding plan.’ --- in other words, they do NOT consider it a treaty .. they only consider it "a plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement" -- which is something that Obama and Kerry made up to circumvent the US Constitution's provisions for ratifying a treaty. it is NOT being treated like a treaty. The House and Senate can only debate it and either vote to approve or disapprove the whole agreement "as is." If it were a treaty the U.S. Senate, alone, would debate it and could amend the treaty. If it were a treaty, the U.S. Senate could reject it -- and there are easily enough votes to reject it. But Obama and Kerry do NOT consider it a treaty -- so even if the House and Senate reject the agreement .. Obama can veto that rejection .. and then BOTH the House and Senate would have to override the veto to stop the deal.
THAT is the problem. Obama and Kerry are shitting on the U.S. Constitution and the whole system of checks and balance as well as separation of powers. Obama thinks he is an absolute monarch.
George Amedore & Christian Klueg for NYS Senate 2016 Pete Vroman for State Assembly 2016[/size][/color]
"For this is what America is all about. It is the uncrossed desert and the unclimbed ridge. It is the star that is not reached and the harvest that is sleeping in the unplowed ground." Lyndon Baines Johnson
In the United States, the term "treaty" is used in a more restricted legal sense than in international law. U.S. law distinguishes what it calls treaties from congressional-executive agreements and sole-executive agreements.[1] All three classes are considered treaties under international law; they are distinct only from the perspective of internal United States law. Distinctions among the three concern their method of ratification: by two-thirds of the Senate, by normal legislative process, or by the President alone, respectively. The Treaty Clause empowers the President to make or enter into treaties with the "advice and consent" of two-thirds of the Senate. In contrast, normal legislation becomes law after approval by simple majorities in both the Senate and the House of Representatives. Throughout U.S. history, the President has also made international "agreements" through congressional-executive agreements (CEAs) that are ratified with only a majority from both houses of Congress, or sole-executive agreements made by the President alone. Though the Constitution does not expressly provide for any alternative to the Article II treaty procedure, Article I, Section 10 of the Constitution does distinguish between treaties (which states are forbidden to make) and agreements (which states may make with the consent of Congress). The Supreme Court of the United States has considered congressional-executive and sole-executive agreements to be valid, and they have been common throughout American history. Thomas Jefferson explained that the Article II treaty procedure is not necessary when there is no long-term commitment: It is desirable, in many instances, to exchange mutual advantages by Legislative Acts rather than by treaty: because the former, though understood to be in consideration of each other, and therefore greatly respected, yet when they become too inconvenient, can be dropped at the will of either party: whereas stipulations by treaty are forever irrevocable but by joint consent...
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
A reasonable person would think that an agreement about nuclear weapons would be a treaty - and have the backing of International Law (as treaties do)) to ensure enforcement ... instead the Obama, Clinton and Kerry crew have insisted that it be a "a plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement." IMHO, they could have just written the deal on toilet paper .. it would have the same value as "a plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement" and the paper could actually be used for a useful purpose.
George Amedore & Christian Klueg for NYS Senate 2016 Pete Vroman for State Assembly 2016[/size][/color]
"For this is what America is all about. It is the uncrossed desert and the unclimbed ridge. It is the star that is not reached and the harvest that is sleeping in the unplowed ground." Lyndon Baines Johnson
“Iran is like the health care debate for Republicans. They’re filled with rage but not with ideas.”
— David Axelrod
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
The FACT is that "a plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement" has no standing in International Law and either party can walk away from it at any time - without consequences. This "a plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement" is therefore unenforceable no matter what words Kerry or Obama says are in the "plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement." "a plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement" Also, it took 8 years to fully implement the current set of sanctions. To say that if the Iranians break the "plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement" than sanctions will be put back is -- to say it mildly -- a pile of horse sh*t. Once the sanctions are lifted, Iran will be free to do whatever it wants. Oh -- and as for war -- since it would take so long to reestablish sanction -- the likelihood is that when Iran gets a nuclear weapon ... the only way to deter them from using it against US, Israel, Saudi Arabia, any other nation or against their own people -- would be to take military action. This "a plan that will have in it a capacity for enforcement" doesn't reduce or eliminate the chance for a war -- it increases the chances for war significantly.
George Amedore & Christian Klueg for NYS Senate 2016 Pete Vroman for State Assembly 2016[/size][/color]
"For this is what America is all about. It is the uncrossed desert and the unclimbed ridge. It is the star that is not reached and the harvest that is sleeping in the unplowed ground." Lyndon Baines Johnson
The Obama plan... An agreement that may work at keeping Iran from a nuke. The Republican alternative??? Just like the "republican alternative for ObamaCare, There is none.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
The Republicans have a plan. It is keep the sanctions in place. Don't aid and abet our enemies (Iran) who have declared war on us and have been sponsoring terrorism against the U.S., its allies and the rest of western civilization for 36 years now. Obama & Kerry and all who support them are quislings.
George Amedore & Christian Klueg for NYS Senate 2016 Pete Vroman for State Assembly 2016[/size][/color]
"For this is what America is all about. It is the uncrossed desert and the unclimbed ridge. It is the star that is not reached and the harvest that is sleeping in the unplowed ground." Lyndon Baines Johnson
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
Saudi Prince Threatens 'Military Action Without American Support' Against Iran The prince was less polite in an op-ed he wrote for the London-based Arabic news Web site Elaph. He compared the Iran nuclear deal made by Obama to the North Korean nuclear deal Bill Clinton made. Bandar suggested that they were both bad deals but Clinton made a bad deal with the best of intentions thinking it was a good deal. Obama on the other hand knew he was making a lousy deal and made it anyway. Jeff Dunetz | July 17, 2015 6:01pm ET http://www.mrctv.org/blog/saud.....-table-or-without-us
Saudi Prince Threatens 'Military Action Without American Support' Against Iran The prince was less polite in an op-ed he wrote for the London-based Arabic news Web site Elaph. He compared the Iran nuclear deal made by Obama to the North Korean nuclear deal Bill Clinton made. Bandar suggested that they were both bad deals but Clinton made a bad deal with the best of intentions thinking it was a good deal. Obama on the other hand knew he was making a lousy deal and made it anyway. Jeff Dunetz | July 17, 2015 6:01pm ET http://www.mrctv.org/blog/saud.....-table-or-without-us
Shadow's source (It might as well be FoxSnooze)
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The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
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