Quoted from Shadow

Every time the government takes over or creates a new department or program it puts a greater burden on the taxpayer who can't pay for the debt we already have. Taxing the rich is a joke as even if the government taxed them at 100% it would not even put a small dent in our massive debt. The tax code has to be revised, spending has to be drastically cut back, and the size of government has to be reduced or we are destined to become another Greece. Even SS, Medicare, and Medicaid must be overhauled because that's where the greatest spending is occurring.

It's amazing that you see the entire problem from the Conservative "anti tax" view.

The govt is out of money.  They can cut programs, raise taxes, or a combination of the two.  Had the Bush Tax Cuts
never happened, the economy would not have crashed as it did.  Had the wealthiest Americans continued to pay a
reasonable amount of our tax burden, the Bush Economic Meltdown would have been a slight bump in the economic
road.

The ONLY Republican solution to our government's economic problem... IS TO INCREASE THE PROBLEM BY CUTTING
THE AMOUNT OF TAXES IT TAKES IN WITH MORE TAX CUTS.
Ridiculous!

Box you're using the same old story blaming everything on the Bush tax cuts but not a word about the meltdown of the housing bubble created by the Dems in our government who created Freddie and Fannie and then let it fail. It was the perfect storm, excessive spending, housing bubble, greedy wall street along with the banks that combined to bring down the system. If you create a flat/fair tax then everybody pays their fair share so why are the Dems fighting against it. We don't have a taxing problem we have a spending problem. Socialism has never worked anywhere in the world because all the governments ran out of other peoples money far too soon. Your solution is to tax the rich to death so go ahead and see just how much that helps our situation. Your idols Keynesian economics plan isn't working too well either. Obama has been if office for 3 years so the unemployment numbers and the economy are now his even though the Dems would like to keep blaming Bush for the next 100 years. He controlled all three branches of government for 2 years and could have done anything he wanted to but now that he lost the house in 2010 it's all the Reps fault. It's time Obama mans up and takes some responsibility for some of this mess.

Quoted from Shadow

Box you're using the same old story blaming everything on the Bush tax cuts but not a word about the meltdown of the housing bubble created by the Dems in our government who created Freddie and Fannie and then let it fail. It was the perfect storm, excessive spending, housing bubble, greedy wall street along with the banks that combined to bring down the system. If you create a flat/fair tax then everybody pays their fair share so why are the Dems fighting against it. We don't have a taxing problem we have a spending problem. Socialism has never worked anywhere in the world because all the governments ran out of other peoples money far too soon. Your solution is to tax the rich to death so go ahead and see just how much that helps our situation. Your idols Keynesian economics plan isn't working too well either. Obama has been if office for 3 years so the unemployment numbers and the economy are now his even though the Dems would like to keep blaming Bush for the next 100 years. He controlled all three branches of government for 2 years and could have done anything he wanted to but now that he lost the house in 2010 it's all the Reps fault. It's time Obama mans up and takes some responsibility for some of this mess.

It's like a one man walking Republican commercial!  

Quoted from Box A Rox

The govt is out of money.  They can cut programs, raise taxes, or a combination of the two.  Had the Bush Tax Cuts
never happened, the economy would not have crashed as it did.  Had the wealthiest Americans continued to pay a
reasonable amount of our tax burden, the Bush Economic Meltdown would have been a slight bump in the economic
road.

Where do you get this crap from?  The most recent economic crash began after the dot com bubble burst.   They tried to reinflate the bubble with artificially LOW interest rates set by the Federal Reserve that created a MASSIVE houseing bubble between 1999 and 2008. You compound the low interest rates and government policy that was aimed a low income homeownership and you have a recipe for disaster.  

Tax rates and GWB have nothing to do with the economic crash.  The problem was people had accessibility to cheap money.  Housing devolopers built house with cheap money, and buyers mortaged these houses with cheap money.  The demand for home mortgages was so high, home mortagage companies were popping up all over the place.  It was it's own industry.  The problem is, the demand wasn't real, it was driven by people purchasing homes without the means to pay it back.  We had 25 year old waitresses buy homes with no money down.

The tax rate doesn't matter when a government can borrow from a central bank.  The Federal Reserve indirectly taxes us each time they expand the money supply and devaluing our dollar to fund government programs.  Whether it be welfare or warfare, it's all funded on borrowed money.   We are a debtor nation, but we have reached the end of the road.  America doesn't produce enough to pay off our debt.  If we don't realize this, we are on the road to a European style nation, and suffer their same fate.  If it's not already too late.

Quoted from CICERO

Where do you get this crap from?  The most recent economic crash began after the dot com bubble burst.   They tried to reinflate the bubble with artificially LOW interest rates set by the Federal Reserve that created a MASSIVE houseing bubble between 1999 and 2008. You compound the low interest rates and government policy that was aimed a low income homeownership and you have a recipe for disaster.  

Tax rates and GWB have nothing to do with the economic crash.  The problem was people had accessibility to cheap money.  Housing devolopers built house with cheap money, and buyers mortaged these houses with cheap money.  The demand for home mortgages was so high, home mortagage companies were popping up all over the place.  It was it's own industry.  The problem is, the demand wasn't real, it was driven by people purchasing homes without the means to pay it back.  We had 25 year old waitresses buy homes with no money down.

The tax rate doesn't matter when a government can borrow from a central bank.  The Federal Reserve indirectly taxes us each time they expand the money supply and devaluing our dollar to fund government programs.  Whether it be welfare or warfare, it's all funded on borrowed money.   We are a debtor nation, but we have reached the end of the road.  America doesn't produce enough to pay off our debt.  If we don't realize this, we are on the road to a European style nation, and suffer their same fate.  If it's not already too late.

I'm just going to make another thread and I'll show you the 'Smoking Gun' that ties policy to the housing crash

http://www.rotterdamny.net/v-post/b-general3/m-/post-1/

the criminals ARE the previous generations that SET UP THE STUPID SYSTEM and have allowed the usurping of people's ability to survive/prosper and be independent.....

the grey panthers can do what we are all NOT told to do(but should be).....support yourself...I'm sorry the government lied to you...you bought it lock-stock-barrel.....and voted for the same crap over and over and over and over....

apparently they dont give a rats a$$ about those supporting them because why? they deserve it? because they are 'old'? really? NO ONE not even by age is more equal than another.....

hhhhmmmm.....that's funny......the rest of us feel the same way......

they are balancing the budget on MY back......I'm the person that pays YOUR salary....

why should I be at a higher risk to lose what I have because of my tax levy/bill while your salaray is GUARANTEED along with a COLA....really?

the billionaires get a return on their $$ to employ the 99%....why? because the unions say so AND so do those we elect who buy votes

all we have to do is have a national DONT GO TO WORK WEEK.....ya dont need a union for that

occupy has an idea we have to forge it into a machine not just some messy camp ground...the tea party movement was organized but it became as stale bread like unions do...the occupy just was/is.....

the entire conversation started off civil....like talking to an adult that wont listen

first the Tea party...open dialogue
then the occupy....physical waiting
next is...??????

what does a child do when it's intellectual needs are NOT met.....

shame on the leaders who think they can pacify
shame on the leaders who divide
shame on the leaders who patronise
shame on the leaders who are condescending

Quoted Text

Executive pay is out of whack, but so are protesters’ demands

    I both agree and disagree with the Occupy Wall Street demonstrations.
    After reading some of the complaints of CEO pay by the Occupy Wall Streeters, I searched the Internet and found that the pay for the top CEOs in 1980 was about 40 times that of the average worker in his company. Today it is more than 500 times!
    Some of these salaries are $84.5 million (Viacom); $76.1 million. (Oxy Petroleum); and $70.1 million (Oracle). Despite angry opposition, Disney Co. shareholders overwhelmingly approved a salary and bonus package for Chief Executive Michael Eisner that could be worth $200 million over 10 years. The article stated, if employees got the same increases over this same 30-year period, as CEOs, average salaries would be in the range of $200,000 per year.
    Another valid complaint: Banks and brokerage houses that received taxpayer bailouts used part of that money to give their CEOs large bonuses. To take one particular case, Robert Rubin, (mentioned in Robert Scheer’s Nov. 7 column, “Rubin should be in prison with Madoff,” was President Clinton’s treasury secretary. He received $126 million in cash and stock during his two-year tenure at Citigroup. This was after Citigroup received a taxpayer bailout.
    To give an idea of how much money this is, U.S. government bonds are one of the safest investments. The yield on the 30-year treasury is 3.75 percent. This breaks down to an income of $37,500 for every $1 million invested. His $126 million could result in a total income of $4,725,000 per year, which is state tax free.
    I have nothing against making money, for we have many in this country in the billionaire category. I agree with the Wall Street protesters that failed companies receiving taxpayer bailouts should not pay exiting CEOs such large salaries.
    Where the Wall Street protesters go astray is in demanding that the government is obligated to take from [the rich] and give to [them]. This attitude exists because the generations following WWII wanted their children to have better lives than they did, and became known as the give-and-give generation. This do-good attitude, of giving and giving, resulted in the formation of the take-and-take generation. As a result, people in this new generation feel they are entitled to a free education, free health care and free unemployment benefits until they decide it’s time to get a job. I can sympathize with them because they are merely reacting to human nature of doing the least amount for the most benefi ts.
    There is no question that the unfairness of pay between CEOs and workers is a valid one. Unfortunately, life is not fair. The hard lesson we all had to learn is that self-gratification does not come in the form of taking and taking, but from hard work and sacrifi ce. When they forget about how much the rich make, and concentrate on bettering themselves, then and only then will they pick up their tents and become productive citizens.

    VINCE ALESCIO
    Clifton Park

http://www.dailygazette.net/De.....r01102&AppName=1

Bill Moyers  last broadcast still applies today...

this would be where we handed over our liberty to those who we think 'know best for us'......we allowed it, we worshipped it, we believed it.....

unions are also a group that tell you what your liberty is

In an exclusive from MSNBC’s Chris Hayes and the Huffington Post, a Washington D.C. lobbying firm has prepared a memo
for its Wall Street bank clients informing them of ways to deal with “Occupy Wall Street” and the political fallout the
movement may cause.

The memo was written by the firm Clark, Lytle, Geduldig, and Cranford (CLGC), warning the the American Bankers
Association (ABA) that Republicans could turn on them as a strategic move in next year’s elections due to Democratic
pressure. CLGC proposed to the ABA an $800,000 price tag on receiving “opposite research” from the firm in order to
create “negative narratives” about Occupy Wall Street and the politicians who support them.

Hayes notes in his show Saturday morning that two of the firm’s members, Sam Geduldig and Jay Cranford, were aides
for House Speaker John Boehner (R-Oh).

Occupy 'anything' has become the laughing stock. Talked to some folks in NYC and they said it is nothing but a circus of freaks. No one will or does take them the least bit seriously!!! The majority are just a bunch of lazy bums who need to bathe!! If this is the best the liberal socialists could drum up.....they are pathetic!!!

Even the liberal media is keeping their distance.