I think a better example is if General Douglas MacArthur referencing military tactics from Sun Tzu's Art of War or Gustav II Adolf and how he personally executed those tactics on the battlefield. Not only is MacArthur a successful modern era General, but also understands the history of the tactics he is using. That is what Gatto is doing. It isn't political like you claim, it is understanding the tactics he was taught and how and why they are used.
History is always a part of any good generals battle plans. (I'm surprised you didn't know that)
Military and cultural history is a large part of Officer candidate school, and the nuances of battle history are a major part of Officer training. It's a prerequisite to any Military leaders planning of a battle.
As a lowly recruit in boot camp, (not an officer) we must have studied the history of at least 60 battles... Tripoli, Belleau Wood, Badensburg, Iwo Jima, Inchon, Battle of Chapultepec, The Caribbean "Banana Wars", New Orleans, Wake Island, Guadalcanal, Tarawa, Okinawa, The Chosin Resivoir etc etc etc.
A mediocre General would be proficient in history... a great general would likely be an expert. However, Great Generals are notorious for making 'political' missteps... so comparing your 'teacher' to a military general doesn't really make much sense.
(Your lack of military background once again leaves you with out the necessary facts to back up your posts. )
Your "teacher" used the present system to get a good education... but his politics is now trying to deprive American kids of the same good education. Much like the TeaBaggers, his agenda is POLITICS driven... not based on a good education.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
So are you advocating that kids shouldn't be required to get an education?
Great Question! ABSOLUTELY NOT!
This is a thread attempting to draw the distinction between - Education - and - Schooling - and hopefully make people at least curious enough to do some of their own basic internet research into the pubic education system and the designers and purpose. I believe education is vitally important. I just question if the compulsory system that is in place, a system that many Americans, and even teachers working in it, recognize as a overall failure.
Kids deserve an education, they deserve critical thinking skills, they deserve problem solving skills, they deserve to come to their own conclusions, NOT rote memorization, multiple choice, true/false and pre determined answers. Those techniques are actually designed to prevent a child's mind from developing the ability to make the links and connection required for critical thinking. It teaches to rely on authority to give you a narrow range of possibilities to a problem.
I don't claim to know the answers...I may sound very opinionated, but that is in hopes stirring some debate. My hope is that parents of school aged children focus on their child's education and when their child is falling behind or "acting out", to instead of blaming the teachers or administrators, to look at the system itself and how it is affecting your child.
Much like the TeaBaggers, his agenda is POLITICS driven... not based on a good education.
What the fu(k do I have to gain politically? You make no sense! The department of education is a tool of both the Republican and Democrat, run by appointees from both parties. I know everything is hyper political to you, and that is a symptom of the totalitarian state. So I understand that you are unable to think otherwise. Any questioning of a compulsory state bureaucracy must be a political attack.
All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state.
A mediocre General would be proficient in history... a great general would likely be an expert. However, Great Generals are notorious for making 'political' missteps... so comparing your 'teacher' to a military general doesn't really make much sense.
How about this one - the teacher represents a 1st Sergeant in the Generals Army. And the 1st Sergeant researched WHAT techniques were used to condition the soldier to be able to take orders to risk their life and kill without regard for their own moral beliefs prior to enlisting, and without regard for the family they leave behind. You know, research how the military is able to strip a person of self and instinct of self preservation, take control of their minds and use them as pawns for some greater cause. And how it is done generation after generation without anybody catching on.
What the fu(k do I have to gain politically? You make no sense! The department of education is a tool of both the Republican and Democrat, run by appointees from both parties. I know everything is hyper political to you, and that is a symptom of the totalitarian state. So I understand that you are unable to think otherwise. Any questioning of a compulsory state bureaucracy must be a political attack.
All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state.
Are You High??? (sounds like it)
OK Cic... I'm serious. Click on your video and listen to (at least) the first minute and a half of it... OK? What you will hear is 100% about politics... 0% about Education. There is NOTHING about the best ways to teach, or methods of learning, or even the old Readin Ritin And Rithmatick. IT'S ALL ABOUT CLASS AND GOVERNMENT POLITICS!
Listen to YOUR video and see if I am right or wrong.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
How about this one - the teacher represents a 1st Sergeant in Generals Army. And the 1st Sergeant researched WHAT techniques were used to condition the soldier to be able to take orders to risk their life and kill without regard for their own moral beliefs prior to enlisting, and without regard for the family they leave behind. You know, research how the military is able to strip a person of self and instinct of self preservation, take control of their minds and use them as pawns for some greater cause. And how it is done generation after generation without anybody catching on.
Cic is talkin through his butt again. Cic...try posting on a subject that you know something about... you know: something like MTV, or Weed, or Michael Jackson.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
OK Cic... I'm serious. Click on your video and listen to (at least) the first minute and a half of it... OK? What you will hear is 100% about politics... 0% about Education. There is NOTHING about the best ways to teach, or methods of learning, or even the old Readin Ritin And Rithmatick. IT'S ALL ABOUT CLASS AND GOVERNMENT POLITICS!
Listen to YOUR video and see if I am right or wrong.
Box, public school is a COMPULSORY GOVERNMENT INSTITUTION. You cannot have have a discussion about the COMPULSORY PUBLIC SCHOOL and it's origin without discussing how it was implemented. All discussions about government institutions will have a political element, SINCE THAT HOW GOVERNMENT INSTITUTIONS ARE CREATED - POLITICALLY. There is nothing in that piece that showed any bias toward one political party or another. It may have mentioned social philosophy, but I didn't detect any attempt at some political gain.
You can't have a discussion about Social Security without discussing FDR, the great depression, and the mood of the nation, you can't have a discussion about the Federal Reserve without discussing Woodrow Wilson, WWI, and the mood of the nation, you can't discuss Medicare without discussing LBJ, vietnam, civil rights, and the mood of the nation.
How you separate politics from the history of government institutions is virtually impossible. But good try.
Cic is talkin through his butt again. Cic...try posting on a subject that you know something about... you know: something like MTV, or Weed, or Michael Jackson.
Box, public school is a COMPULSORY GOVERNMENT INSTITUTION. You cannot have have a discussion about the COMPULSORY PUBLIC SCHOOL and it's origin without discussing how it was implemented. All discussions about government institutions will have a political element, SINCE THAT HOW GOVERNMENT INSTITUTIONS ARE CREATED - POLITICALLY. There is nothing in that piece that showed any bias toward one political party or another. It may have mentioned social philosophy, but I didn't detect any attempt at some political gain.
You can't have a discussion about Social Security without discussing FDR, the great depression, and the mood of the nation, you can't have a discussion about the Federal Reserve without discussing Woodrow Wilson, WWI, and the mood of the nation, you can't discuss Medicare without discussing LBJ, vietnam, civil rights, and the mood of the nation.
How you separate politics from the history of government institutions is virtually impossible. But good try.
OK... Then you listen to your video... and tell me at what point does the video have anything to do with EDUCATION. Not the geo-political dogma of Germany pre ww2... but teaching our kids about what they need to learn.
You may see this as an education issue, but the video you posted is all about controlling the masses not education.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
You may see this as an education issue, but the video you posted is all about controlling the masses not education.
Hence the thread topic...Is public school meant to educate the masses or create social order out of the masses? Is the inner city school failing because they are poorly run, or failing by design to keep that population at a certain level of literacy? Based on some of the writing of the founders of modern public schooling, it sound as if it is the latter.
An interesting study would be to see what percentage of Niskayuna School graduates married and had children with Schenectady City School graduates. You would think it would be pretty high based on geographical proximity. Unless the social classes are really separated by the design of school districts.
Hence the thread topic...Is public school meant to educate the masses or create social order out of the masses?
So you agree... the video is political... not about education.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
education would require the political school system to teach people how to educate themselves instead of waiting to get spoonfed
I had 3 teachers in my schools career who would repeat OVER AND OVER AND OVER again....educate yourself so you know, don't listen to others. learn how to educate yourself...take these tools to educate yourself.
the rest were folks by rote....and they wore their union/strike shirts in view of the students but never once offered 'education' about them...from ALL sides....they only spoke out of one side of their mouths....
yup,,,that's education to a 13year old.....
...you are a product of your environment, your environment is a product of your priorities, your priorities are a product of you......
The replacement of morality and conscience with law produces a deadly paradox.
STOP BEING GOOD DEMOCRATS---STOP BEING GOOD REPUBLICANS--START BEING GOOD AMERICANS
So you agree... the video is political... not about education.
The thread is called 'the purpose of schooling', same as the video. I don't know the party affiliation of Alexander Englis from which he references the 6 purposes of schooling. I really am having trouble finding the political slant you talk about. It describes the origin of the system and STATED purpose. There is no inferring by Gatto.
The thread is called 'the purpose of schooling', same as the video. I don't know the party affiliation of Alexander Englis from which he references the 6 purposes of schooling. I really am having trouble finding the political slant you talk about. It describes the origin of the system and STATED purpose. There is no inferring by Gatto.
I didn't say a "political slant" or a Dem vs Rep agenda. From the beginning my posts have said that the video is NOT about education. The video is about controlling society by controlling schools. Controlling the mindset of the students to conform to a political view.
"Education" is barely mentioned.
The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness. John Kenneth Galbraith
Logged
)
