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Obama's Illegal War
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Henry
June 6, 2011, 12:30pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from CICERO


WHOOOAH...Wait a minute...We were promised CHANGE and HOPE!  I thought we were transcending politics in America with the election of Barack Obama.  This wasn't going to be "politics as usual".  We were closing Gitmo, we were bringing our troops home, ending the warrantless wiretapping.  We were reshaping our image in the world, specifically the Muslim world.  This was gonna be DIFFERENT.  Box, are you telling us nothing changed?  Are you saying politics are politics, regardless of party?  I can't believe what I'm reading.  You don’t think Obama could have "unengaged" the troops and then congress could have scaled down the military spending? I guess that too would have been political suicide.


He sold out what he campaigned on, if he actually followed through with everything you wrote I would actually support him and so would many libertarians.


"In the beginning of a change, the Patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot."

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Box A Rox
June 6, 2011, 3:16pm Report to Moderator

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All Politicians have to work with in the system.  Jimmy Carter was a governor from GA with no ties to the DC establishment...
It won  him the election after the stench of Nixon's Watergate & then the Ford Pardon...
It lost him the next election because Carter had no arms to twist in DC to get things done.

Ronny Reagan promised to "balance the budget in 4 years"  Instead Reagan/Bush went from $1trillion in debt, to $3trillion.  
Cicero never seems to bring up the Republican promises... (He just assumes that all Republican politicians lie... he doesn't expect them to tell the truth)... he only brings up Democrat broken promises.


The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral
philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

John Kenneth Galbraith

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CICERO
June 6, 2011, 3:54pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox
Cicero never seems to bring up the Republican promises... (He just assumes that all Republican politicians lie... he doesn't expect them to tell the truth)... he only brings up Democrat broken promises.


Last I checked, the past 2+ years it has been a Democrat president...Why would I bring up Republicans?  

As I grow older and wiser and look at the American political system during my lifetime as it is, and not as I'm TOLD to look at it.  I have come to the conclusion that both parties are interested in consolidating power and taking away individual liberties in order to preserve their place at the top of the food chain, with the relationship between billion dollar multi-national corporations and the ever expanding government and the restricting laws, regulations, and taxes.  With the inflating of the dollar eroding my savings daily, and my 401K investments evaporating, I have reached the conclusion that the government, along with the central bankers, and multi national corporations have created a cast system where there are two classes of citizens, the rich and the rest.  The rest continue to run on the hamster wheel still believing in the dream of becoming rich if you just work harder.  Well, those days are gone.  You work hard and just when you think you got ahead, your savings in dollars is cut in half because of inflation, and your investments are lost to the robber barons on Wall Street, and the equity in your house is gone because of our monitary policy.  I am sick of the Democrat and Republican argument, they are both bullshit, both could give a sh*t about the people and only want to preserve the party and their personal interests.

Ron Paul is the only one pointing out that we no longer live in a democracy.  In 1988, running as a libertarian, Paul was denied the chance to stand on the same stage with the Democrats and Republicans during the debate, which greatly limited his ability to join the public debate and have his ideas heard. Paul spent millions of dollars of his own money just to get on the ballot in many states.  The systems rigged, and Paul is the only one willing to say it like it is.  Paul is the only one willing to pull down the curtain and expose the wizard of oz.  

If Paul is able to get traction and created a large following, threatening REAL CHANGE, he will most likely end up like many leader of social or political revolutions that challenge the status quo – assassinated.


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Box A Rox
June 6, 2011, 5:00pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from CICERO

Ron Paul is the only one pointing out that we no longer live in a democracy.


The USA has never been a democracy... we've always been a republic.


The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral
philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

John Kenneth Galbraith

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Kevin March
June 6, 2011, 5:04pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox


The USA has never been a democracy... we've always been a republic.


Partially true.  A representative republic.  If it were a true republic, all people able to vote would vote on each bill.  We, instead, elect those who vote on the bills.


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CICERO
June 6, 2011, 5:13pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox


The USA has never been a democracy... we've always been a republic.


We haven't been a republic since 1913 and the passage of the 17th amendment.  We are a representative democracy.  Wake-up, get a book.  Again, lets look at REALITY and not rely on what your public indoctrinator told you.

Here's a helping hand.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1567856/posts


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Shadow
June 6, 2011, 5:31pm Report to Moderator
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When we went to allowing our elected officials vote for us is where we made a huge mistake. The power corrupts them soon after they are elected and when that happens all they care about is getting re-elected so as not to lose the power and control.
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Box A Rox
June 6, 2011, 5:40pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from CICERO


We haven't been a republic since 1913 and the passage of the 17th amendment.  We are a representative democracy.  Wake-up, get a book.  Again, lets look at REALITY and not rely on what your public indoctrinator told you.

Here's a helping hand.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1567856/posts


LMAO!
The Free Republic!!!

Why not RedNecks R US?

From their own site:
Free Republic is the premier online gathering place for independent, grass-roots conservatism on the web. We're working to roll back decades of governmental largesse, to root out political fraud and corruption, and to champion causes which further conservatism in America. And we always have fun doing it. Hoo-yah!
Where they modestly proclaim:
Welcome to Free Republic!
The Premier Conservative Site on the Net!



The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral
philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

John Kenneth Galbraith

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CICERO
June 6, 2011, 6:08pm Report to Moderator

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Of course, classic box, if the facts make you uncomfortable, mock the source.  Your public educators did a very good job indoctrinating you to embrace you ignorance,  and only accept the information the state run media tells you is acceptable.  The U.S. is a Republic. lol  Do states have the right to opt out of Obamacare?  Republic my a**.




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Henry
June 6, 2011, 6:12pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Shadow
When we went to allowing our elected officials vote for us is where we made a huge mistake. The power corrupts them soon after they are elected and when that happens all they care about is getting re-elected so as not to lose the power and control.


It was a good system as long as they stayed within their constitutional authority, once they started pushing it out of the way with no resistance from the people is when it went to hell. We took our freedoms and government for granted and that is why it is out of control, if we don't hold their feet to the fire it is most definite they will abuse their power.



"In the beginning of a change, the Patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot."

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Box A Rox
June 6, 2011, 7:17pm Report to Moderator

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A republic and a democracy are identical in every aspect except one. In a republic the sovereignty is in each individual person. In a democracy the sovereignty is in the group.

Republic. That form of government in which the powers of sovereignty are vested in the people and are exercised by the people, either directly, or through representatives chosen by the people, to whom those powers are specially delegated.

Democracy. That form of government in which the sovereign power resides in and is exercised by the whole body of free citizens directly or indirectly through a system of representation, as distinguished from a monarchy, aristocracy, or oligarchy.
In a pure democracy, 51% beats 49%. In other words, the minority has no rights. The minority only has those privileges granted by the dictatorship of the majority.


The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral
philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

John Kenneth Galbraith

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CICERO
June 6, 2011, 7:42pm Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox
A republic and a democracy are identical in every aspect except one. In a republic the sovereignty is in each individual person. In a democracy the sovereignty is in the group.

Republic. That form of government in which the powers of sovereignty are vested in the people and are exercised by the people, either directly, or through representatives chosen by the people, to whom those powers are specially delegated.

Democracy. That form of government in which the sovereign power resides in and is exercised by the whole body of free citizens directly or indirectly through a system of representation, as distinguished from a monarchy, aristocracy, or oligarchy.
In a pure democracy, 51% beats 49%. In other words, the minority has no rights. The minority only has those privileges granted by the dictatorship of the majority.


Every state representative to the federal government is elected through pure democracy, whether it's a Congressperson or Senator - 51% beats 49%.  New York State has a population of 19 million people, 8 million of which live in NYC.  This is why our Senators spend most of their time in NYC and southern NY, and upstate is left to rot.  That is because instead of the original system prior to the 17th amendment, the 150 assembly district representative, and 62 state senate district that voted to select the Senator to represent New York State.  I don't know about you, but my districts state representative and senators votes out of 150 and 62 would be a more weighted and fair vote, than my 1 vote cast into the sea of 19 million.

Chuck Shumer and Kirsten Gillibrand represent 51% of New York's 19 million in a our representative democracy - NOT REPUBLIC.

2011 - America is about as much a republic as the Soviet socialist republics.  New York resembles the Ukraine under Soviet rule, and Washington D.C. resembles Moscow under Soviet rule.


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Shadow
June 8, 2011, 8:42pm Report to Moderator
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NYTimes.com
U.S. Is Intensifying a Secret Campaign of Yemen Airstrikes
By MARK MAZZETTI
Published: June 8, 2011

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration has intensified the American covert war in Yemen, exploiting a growing power vacuum in the country to strike at militant suspects with armed drones and fighter jets, according to American officials.

The acceleration of the American campaign in recent weeks comes amid a violent conflict in Yemen that has left the government in Sana, a United States ally, struggling to cling to power. Yemeni troops that had been battling militants linked to Al Qaeda in the south have been pulled back to the capital, and American officials see the strikes as one of the few options to keep the militants from consolidating power.

On Friday, American jets killed Abu Ali al-Harithi, a midlevel Qaeda operative, and several other militant suspects in a strike in southern Yemen. According to witnesses, four civilians were also killed in the airstrike. Weeks earlier, drone aircraft fired missiles aimed at Anwar al-Awlaki, the radical American-born cleric who the United States government has tried to kill for more than a year. Mr. Awlaki survived.
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Box A Rox
June 9, 2011, 5:11am Report to Moderator

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Yemen?

It was recently labeled "the Bush Doctrine" but it's been in practice in one form or another for decades:

* "Make no distinction between terrorists and the nations that harbor them--and hold both to account."
* "Take the fight to the enemy overseas before they can attack us again here at home."
* "Confront threats before they fully materialize."

~April, 1986 Reagan's launched an Air Strike against Qaddafi in Libya...
~Aug 21 1990, Bill Clinton launched Cruise Missiles against Al Qaeda terrorists in Sudan and Afghanistan...
~ GWB bombed everyone everywhere...

The policy is a continuation of US attacks against Terrorists  anywhere.


The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral
philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.

John Kenneth Galbraith

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CICERO
June 9, 2011, 6:05am Report to Moderator

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Quoted from Box A Rox
Yemen?

It was recently labeled "the Bush Doctrine" but it's been in practice in one form or another for decades:

* "Make no distinction between terrorists and the nations that harbor them--and hold both to account."
* "Take the fight to the enemy overseas before they can attack us again here at home."
* "Confront threats before they fully materialize."

~April, 1986 Reagan's launched an Air Strike against Qaddafi in Libya...
~Aug 21 1990, Bill Clinton launched Cruise Missiles against Al Qaeda terrorists in Sudan and Afghanistan...
~ GWB bombed everyone everywhere...

The policy is a continuation of US attacks against Terrorists  anywhere.



Oh...OK, so now we're footnoting Bush policies to justify Obama policy.

But we're not creating terrorists with our foreign military policies in the middle east like Bush did.  Thank goodness!

Change you can believe in!!

Ron Paul 2012.


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